Ep. 190 (Part 2 of 2) | The eleventh Wisdom Series dialogue with A. H. Almaas brings us to the second turning of his teaching, into the boundless dimension of divine love. Hameed explores this nondual dimension in detail: its qualities, what it’s like to experience firsthand, and what the effects of such an experience are likely to be. This boundless dimension of loving consciousness is the first of the five boundless dimensions, though love continues to develop throughout them all. Hameed gives a beautiful account of his initial experience with this dimension, when divine love and light permeated all of reality. “Why don’t more people experience this if love is always there? asks co-host John Dupuy, and Hameed explains that it’s always there in potential form though not always manifest; the experience is there for when we are ripe for it.

Having awakened to this dimension, one can’t help but want everyone to feel this way, Hameed says, and this is the main reason spiritual teachers teach. Hameed describes the obstacles that prevent us from experiencing the reality of divine love, how it challenges our perceived separateness, and tells us that after experiencing this unity, returning to separateness is not a choice. It turns out that experiencing boundless love is not a panacea for enlightenment, but creates an upwelling of obstacles and a state where our boundedness feels even more restrictive than before. Hameed also relates how hatred and greed can exist in this reality of pure goodness, and tells us that it is here, in the ocean of love and light, that they are transformed. A wonderfully numinous, illuminating conversation. Recorded May 1, 2025.

“The love is what makes us human—you can’t be really human without heart.”

• Two ways of functioning: from the perspective of the soul, or from the perspective of the ocean of love (00:35)
• A third way of functioning is when the ocean manifests the functioning itself (03:58)
• The ocean of love dissolves all fears (06:06)
• Love takes forms; this dimension is an example of the formless taking form (07:06)
• The sense of pure “goodness” in this dimension is unmistakable—you can’t help but want everyone to feel this (10:34)
• Hatred is not a quality of being; it’s a distortion of a quality of being (14:37)
• Hameed’s experience of the beast, an inherent part of the ego (17:40)
• Experiencing Jabba the Hut, who represents greed; greed gets healed in this dimension (21:23)
• Your curiosity—wanting to know and being willing to experience—is the only way to transform greed or hatred; you can’t push them away (29:02)
• Five steps towards true nature (31:41)
• The heart (love) keeps developing through all the dimensions (34:20)
• You can’t be really human without heart (35:32)
• How do we continue to develop and manifest this connection with love? (36:20)

• A. H. Almaas (Hameed Ali), founder of The Ridhwan School, home of

Ep. 189 (Part 1 of 2) | The eleventh Wisdom Series dialogue with A. H. Almaas brings us to the second turning of his teaching, into the boundless dimension of divine love. Hameed explores this nondual dimension in detail: its qualities, what it’s like to experience firsthand, and what the effects of such an experience are likely to be. This boundless dimension of loving consciousness is the first of the five boundless dimensions, though love continues to develop throughout them all. Hameed gives a beautiful account of his initial experience with this dimension, when divine love and light permeated all of reality. “Why don’t more people experience this if love is always there? asks co-host John Dupuy, and Hameed explains that it’s always there in potential form though not always manifest; the experience is there for when we are ripe for it.

Having awakened to this dimension, one can’t help but want everyone to feel this way, Hameed says, and this is the main reason spiritual teachers teach. Hameed describes the obstacles that prevent us from experiencing the reality of divine love, how it challenges our perceived separateness, and tells us that after experiencing this unity, returning to separateness is not a choice. It turns out that experiencing boundless love is not a panacea for enlightenment, but creates an upwelling of obstacles and a state where our boundedness feels even more restrictive than before. Hameed also relates how hatred and greed can exist in this reality of pure goodness, and tells us that it is here, in the ocean of love and light, that they are transformed. A wonderfully numinous, illuminating conversation. Recorded May 1, 2025.

“Full nonduality: not just nonduality between subject and object…but where nothing is separate from anything else—one indivisible medium of loving consciousness.”

• Introducing the 11th dialogue in the A. H. Almaas Wisdom Series, focusing on the first of the five boundless dimensions: the ocean of love and light (00:35)
• Transitioning to the second turning of the teaching: the dimension of divine love (01:54)
• Hameed’s first experience of boundless love (04:46)
• This is what Rumi writes about—it’s not a unique experience but a potential for everyone (10:30)
• Full nonduality: not just between subject and object, but where nothing is separate from anything else (12:00)
• Why don’t more people experience this if love is always there? (14:08)
• All five dimensions (and maybe more) are implicit in nondual consciousness (19:17)
• Obstacles in the way of experiencing divine love (21:03)
• We cannot make this experience of presence happen—it is an emergence, a revelation (22:33)
• The movement back to separateness happens because it has been imprinted in the soul (24:48)
• The experience of divine love creates an upwelling of obstacles (26:27)
• Inquiry is the way to surrender your attachment to yourself as an individual (29:11)
• Our functioning can continue to happen after our boundaries have dissolved (32:35)
• Two main ego identifications: boundedness & our sense of identity (36:02)
• This dimension teaches how we can function as an individual expression of boundless love while not being separate from it (37:59)

• A. H. Almaas (Hameed Ali), founder of

Ep. 188 (Part 2 of 2) | Dr. Sally Adnams Jones has pioneered the field of art therapy as an agent of transformation and healing, choosing to work particularly with people living with no economic infrastructure: refugees, and victims of natural disasters, genocide, war, pandemics, and more. What Sally has found is that creating art within a community works miracles for the dispossessed and traumatized, in that it provides an embodied, practical method of engendering feelings of pride, a sense of belonging, finding one’s voice, and perceiving the future as something one can affect and shape. In fact, this work is applicable to everyone everywhere—it is in accessing our creativity that we come to ask, “How do we start to build the world we need?” An Integral Taoist, Sally shares her perspective on the yin and yang of creativity, explaining that ultimately, creativity is emergence working through the human body.

At the heart of Integral Taoism is an understanding that the nature of emergence itself is to become aware of your polarity and integrate it. The more you do that, the more creative you become. The discussion transitions from the dance of polarity in creativity to how the polarities of yin and yang are playing out in politics today. Sally is a Canadian therapist and exceptionally well informed about politics—here we gain a perspective on current U.S. – Canadian relations and world politics that is revelatory. Recorded May 29, 2025.

“Every single Canadian is deeply traumatized right now.”

• How the movement between parts and whole, yin and yang, plays out in politics (01:21)
• The threat to Canada’s sovereignty, what Canada is doing in response, and Canada’s unifying, integral leader (03:12)
• How did it feel when Trump started talking about annexing Canada? (06:44)
• Under the Trump regime, the U.S. has become an arms dealer (10:21)
• How Sally’s growing up in South Africa under constant threat of civil war informs her views of fascism and the reversal of the American ideal of democracy (13:12)
• Advice for political resisters: establish a line that cannot be crossed (18:54)
• Coordinated resistance to the U.S. from external sources (24:14)
• Global politics, macroeconomics, and the rise of authoritarianism (27:36)
• Misinformation and the radicalization of young white men through the fourth estate (30:22)
• New challenges we face with fascism, and why American tech bros think Western Civilization is under threat (34:54)
• The future: who has control of the skies? (39:49)
• What is the most strategic thing one can do? (41:16)
• How do you stay grounded and balanced? Learning self-regulation, connecting with nature (43:56)

• Sally Adnams Jones, Art-Making with Refugees and Survivors: Creative and Transformative Responses to Trauma After Natural Disasters, War and Other Crises
• Sally’s website: sallyadnamsjones.com
• Sally’s podcast: Radical Emergence