There are many valuations of the podcast industry, depending on what report you read.

• Polaris valued the global worth at $13.7B in 2021, expected to grow an average of 31.5% CAGR (compound annual growth rate) through to 2030 (seems supremely high)
• Fortune Business Insights show is as $2.2B in 2022, projected to grow to $17.59B in 2030, a CAGR of 29.8%

Meanwhile, the IAB shares US ad revenue as $1.8B in 2022, rising to $1.9 in 2023 (which seems closer to Fortune Business Insights and their global ranking). So you can see why there's confusion.

Join Mark and Danny, and this week's guest co-host Rob Greenlee, as they break this all down in the usual In & Around Podcasting way.

Our guest co-host this week: Rob Greenlee

Rob Greenlee, a 2017 Podcast Hall of Fame inductee and podcasting pioneer, has spent over 24 years shaping the online media industry. As founder of Spoken Life Media - Adore Podcast Network and Creator Community, and Multi-Camera Video Production. He is also host of Podcast Tips with Rob Greenlee and Trust Factor Shows, he empowers creators with practical insights and innovative strategies. Rob’s background includes leadership roles at Microsoft, PodcastOne, Spreaker, and Libsyn, where he drove content development, distribution, and partnerships. He also co-hosts the 12-year running New Media Show with Todd Cochrane, providing weekly industry updates. As Chairperson of the Podcast Hall of Fame, Rob continues to champion the podcasting community worldwide through speaking and mentorship.

Rob's Website

Rob on YouTube

Rob's Facebook page

@robwgreenlee on Instagram

@robgreenlee on Twitter

Links to interesting things from this episode

• Arielle Nissenblatt
• Podcast Hall of Fame
• PODFEST EXPO | Where Your Voice Matters
• Podcast Industry Statistics 2024 – Global Market Size and Growth | Comprehensive podcast industry statistics for 2024. Collaborative wiki covers global market size, growth trends, platform market share, and advertising revenue estimates.
• Podcasting Market Size, Share, Revenue | Fortune Business Insights
• Polaris Podcasting Market Size Global Report, 2022 - 2030
• IAB US Podcast Advertising Revenue Study FY2023 May 2024.pdf
• Justin Jackson on X: "I keep seeing two numbers for the podcast industry: "Podcasting is a $2 billion a year industry." "The podcast industry is worth $20 billion." Can anyone tell me where these numbers come from and how they're calculated? (They're often quoted but never cited)" / X

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know...

As Artificial Intelligence continues to be ever more present in podcasting, discussions and conversations have appeared online at an equal rate on whether this is a good or bad thing for the podcasting industry.

Does it make life easier when it comes to creating content, or does it run the risk of making podcasting redundant through an increased lack of originality?

Join Mark, Danny, and guest co-host Liam Heffernan as they dissect the article and review each viewpoint.

Our guest co-host this week: Liam Heffernan

@thisistheheff on Twitter

Links to interesting things from this episode

• Independent Podcast Awards
• Em @Verbal Diorama: A Film History Podcast (@VerbalDiorama) / X
• Verbal Diorama
• Scarlett Johansson’s OpenAI clash is just the start of legal wrangles over artificial intelligence | Artificial intelligence (AI) | The Guardian
• Apollo Pods | Best Podcast App for Fiction Lovers
• How Can Podcast Discoverability Be Improved: The Ultimate Podcast Puzzle - Ear Worthy
• Does AI Need Regulation in Podcasting? - In & Around Podcasting

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, plus wherever else they may listen to their podcasts.

If you'd like your podcast trailer featuring in our "Wave File" segment, submit it via this quick contact form, please.

The podcast is also available at In & Around Podcasting.

It used to be that podcast downloads were the main data point podcasters would use to track their growth. The thinking was, get X amount of downloads per month and sponsors will jump at you with wallets full of cash. While that may have been the way back in the day, today's success metrics looks a lot different when it comes to podcast success.

In this special live recording of In & Around Podcasting from PodSummit YYC 2024 in Calgary, Alberta, Canada, Danny is joined by Kattie Laur and Tim Truax to talk about how you can take advantage of them, and reframe your thinking and discussion around monetization and sponsorship.

Takeaways:

• The podcasting industry is evolving, and metrics should extend beyond just downloads.
• Engaged listeners are more valuable than sheer download numbers when seeking sponsorships.
• Indie podcasters should focus on local sponsorships to create meaningful monetization opportunities.
• Understanding your audience's engagement can help shape your content and sponsorship strategies.
• Value for value models allow listeners to support creators without traditional sponsorships.
• Experimenting with different ad formats can improve listener retention and engagement rates.

Companies mentioned in this episode:

• Bumper
• Captivate
• Apple
• Spotify
• Acast
• Douglas
• AG1
• Buy Me a Coffee
• North Bay Echo
• Canadaland

Our guest co-hosts this week:

Kattie Laur

Kattie Laur is an award-winning, freelance podcast producer and writer based in Brantford, Ontario. She has a life-long love of public radio, and has been clinging to the podcasting space since 2013. As both a professional and independent podcast creator, Kattie’s insights have her keenly focused on making the Canadian podcasting ecosystem sustainable, equitable and world-renowned. Kattie writes the biweekly newsletter for the Canadian podcasting ecosystem, Pod the North. Pod the North’s regular readers include many media excutives from the likes of CBC Podcasts, Spotify and Apple Podcasts. She is currently also working on her debut podcast, Canardian, in association with her newsletter coming Spring 2024.

Kattie's Website

@podthenorth on Instagram

@PodKatt on Twitter

Kattie on YouTube

Links to interesting things from this episode

• PodSummit: Canada's Podcast Event
• Funding Opportunities - ISO-BEA
• SCOOP: A look at the Canadian podcast sponsorship economy.
• Are hyperlocal podcast networks replacing local media?

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on

In a recent article on Hollywood Reporter, top podcasters like Rachel Maddow, Bill Simmons, Josh Lindgren and more shared their take on the biggest issues facing podcasting. These included visibility, podcast apps, lower advertising, and more.

Join Danny and guest co-host Dan LeFebvre as they dissect the article and review each viewpoint.

Our guest co-host this week: Dan LeFebvre

Host of Based on a True Story, the podcast that compares Hollywood with history.

Dan's Website

@danlefeb on Twitter

Dan on YouTube

Dan's Facebook page

Dan's Facebook group

@basedonatruestorypodcast on Instagram

Links to interesting things from this episode

• Start Your Podcast Today - Worry Free - School of Podcasting - Learn "How To Podcast" with Podcast Coach Dave Jackson
• Goodpods 🎧 | Discover, Play & Share Your Favorite Podcasts
• Apollo Pods | Best Podcast App for Fiction Lovers
• Wondery acquires New Heights with Jason and Travis Kelce
• What The Hollywood Reporter Got Right & Wrong In Its Latest Podcast Story
• Podcasting's Biggest Challenges? Maddow, Simmons, Charlamagne Weigh In

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, plus wherever else they may listen to their podcasts.

If you'd like your podcast trailer featuring in our "Wave File" segment, submit it via this quick contact form, please.

The podcast is also available at In & Around Podcasting.

Mentioned in this episode:

Introducing: Life's 2nd Act

Life's 2nd Act: a podcast journey into finding direction and purpose. This is the podcast that delves into the transformative phase of mid/later life, exploring its challenges, new directions and uncertainties that come with it. We do that through talking to people who have a story to tell and insight to share, or a snippet of something special. Sharing stories, exploring dilemmas and seeking solutions...

Apple Podcasts is now available on the web, opening up the Android market and allowing users to listen on Windows. This is a significant milestone for podcasting as it provides more options for listeners and creators. The web player supports syncing across devices and allows for purchasing subscriptions to creators. However, there are potential risks with unethical marketing techniques and spoofing of download referrals. Overall, this move by Apple is a positive step forward for the industry.

Takeaways

• Apple Podcasts is now accessible on the web, expanding its reach to Android and Windows users.
• The web player supports syncing across devices and allows for purchasing subscriptions to creators.
• This move by Apple is a positive step forward for the podcasting industry, providing more options for listeners and creators.

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, plus wherever else they may listen to their podcasts.

If you'd like your podcast trailer featuring in our "Wave File" segment, submit it via this quick contact form, please.

The podcast is also available at In & Around Podcasting.

Currently, if a podcaster wants to get the full picture of their show's growth, they need to look at multiple analytics reports: their hosting company, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and now YouTube. Then they need to correlate how all this data is presented, since it can be very different, depending on IAB Certification, downloads, listens, and more. And that's just the podcaster - then you have media and ad buyer data, too.

So how do we bring all this convoluted data together, and where do podcast analytics need to improve to give that fuller picture? Join your host Danny Brown and guest co-host Dan Misener as they dive in to podcasting's analytics problem.

Our guest co-host this week:

Dan Misener

Dan Misener is co-founder of Bumper, a podcast growth agency. Prior to co-founding Bumper, Dan served as Director of Audience Development at Pacific Content. Prior to that, he spent a decade working in public radio at the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation (CBC), both on-air and behind-the-scenes. He was involved in the CBC's earliest podcasting efforts, and served as producer on many national and local news and current affairs programs. Dan has taught podcasting and audio storytelling at the Dalla Lana School of Public Health and Munk School of Global Affairs and Public Policy at the University of Toronto, the RTA School of Media at Toronto Metropolitan University, and through the Podcast Career Accelerator program at the Hot Docs Podcast Festival. Dan is host and producer of the independent live event and podcast series Grownups Read Things They Wrote as Kids, which has won several industry awards and been downloaded more than 10 million times.

Dan's Website

Links to interesting things from this episode

• TrueFans | Podcasting That Pays
• OP3: The Open Podcast Prefix Project
• Mobile Game Ads Are Boosting Podcast Follower Counts - Bloomberg
• Podcast Standards Project | Advocating for open podcasting
• The State of Podcast Agencies 2024
• Does Podcasting Still Need the IAB? - In & Around Podcasting
• Is the CPM Model in Podcasting Really Unsustainable? - In & Around Podcasting

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, plus wherever else they may listen to their podcasts.

If you'd like your podcast trailer featuring in our "Wave File" segment, submit it via this quick...

Welcome to this bonus episode of In & Around Podcasting. This week, Mark and Danny take a look at this year's Podcast Movement, taking place in Washington, D.C. between August 19 and 22.

They share tips for first time attendees, how to plan your schedule effectively, some things you shouldn't forget, and loads more useful tips.

Links to interesting things from this episode

• Podcast Movement 2024 | Podcast Conference | August in Washington, D.C.

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, plus wherever else they may listen to their podcasts.

If you'd like your podcast trailer featuring in our "Wave File" segment, submit it via this quick contact form, please.

The podcast is also available at In & Around Podcasting.