On the podcast, I talk with Ajay about the fresh opportunities AI is creating for app developers, how they built a cost-effective TikTok growth engine, and why being forced to monetize helped improve their product decisions.

Top Takeaways:
🤖 New tech, new apps – AI isn’t just making apps smarter. It’s enabling new categories entirely.
Apps built around real-time interaction, emotional context, and personalized content wouldn’t have been possible just a year ago. That means product-market fit can emerge in spaces that didn’t even exist before.

🎨 Design spreads – Great visuals are for distribution, not just decoration.
Memorable characters, animations, or interfaces can make your app instantly recognizable in screenshots, social videos, or App Store listings. Strong creative amplifies word-of-mouth.

💸 Monetization pushes clarity – Charging early forces your product to stand up on its own.
When you’re paying for AI infrastructure, you can’t wait to figure out value. Monetizing quickly reveals which users are getting enough utility to stick around and where the gaps are in your experience.

📈 TikTok still works – For the right product, UGC beats polish.
Test fast, post often, and watch what takes off. Lo-fi creator content can outperform paid campaigns, especially if your app is visual and easy to explain. One viral post can change your growth curve overnight.

🧠 Voice AI is tough to fake – Real conversation needs more than an API call.
Delivering a fast, natural back-and-forth requires layered systems: memory lookup, tone control, real-time rendering, and low-latency streaming. It’s a technical challenge and a competitive moat.

About Ajay Mehta:

👽 Co-Founder of Portola, the creators of Tolan—an AI companion app that offers personalized, engaging, and fun experiences.

📈 Ajay is passionate about AI’s potential to revolutionize consumer apps, focusing on building emotionally resonant, interactive experiences.

💡 “Something that AI really allows you to do is make a consumer experience that just feels like there is totally something on the other side that knows you, understands you.”

👋 LinkedIn and Twitter

Follow us on X:

• David Barnard - @drbarnard
• Jacob Eiting - @jeiting
• RevenueCat - @RevenueCat
• SubClub - @SubClubHQ

Episode Highlights:

[1:10] Origin story: How Ajay and the Portola team developed the AI alien buddy app, Tolan.

[7:38] Cash flow: Why the Tolan team secured venture funding instead of bootstrapping.
[11:36] I, Robot: How AI is changing the app landscape and why AI companion apps are especially promising.
[16:36] Cost/Benefit: The costs associated with running an AI app forced Tolan to monetize early (but that wasn’t a bad thing).
[21:17] Onboarding excellence: How Tolan’s onboarding experience fosters deep personalization and long-term retention.
[28:08] Going viral: Why an effective TikTok marketing strategy can dramatically lower your cost per acquisition.
[39:34] A league of their own: Why competition is relatively low (for now) for AI companion apps.
[47:39] Race to the top: Raising venture capital and using the upfront cash infusion to iterate and beat out the competition (à la Duolingo).
[51:18] Tolan 2 (The Sequel): AI engines have the potential to be spun off into multiple app businesses.

On the podcast we discuss how AI is changing both what apps do and how they’re built, the relationship between price and retention, and why React Native apps monetize better than native.

Check out RevenueCat’s State of Subscription Apps 2025 report here: https://revenuecat.com/report

Top Takeaways:

📊 AI apps: Higher revenue per user, but differentiation is key

AI-powered apps don’t convert users at a higher rate, but they earn more per subscriber. People are willing to pay for AI-enhanced features, but success depends on offering real value - simply wrapping a chatbot isn’t enough. The best-performing AI apps focus on unique, high-value use cases.

💰 Hybrid monetization is gaining momentum

More apps are mixing revenue models—offering subscriptions, consumables, and lifetime purchases to appeal to different types of buyers. AI-powered apps, in particular, are finding success with credit-based systems that let heavy users pay more without forcing everyone onto a subscription.

⚡ Most subscription churn happens in the first month—act fast

A huge percentage of cancellations happen right after the first charge. Users need to feel the value of your app immediately, or they’ll turn off auto-renew. Strong onboarding, personalized engagement, and proactive retention strategies make all the difference.

⏳ 80% of trial starts happen on day one - don’t bury your paywall

Users decide quickly. The vast majority of free trials begin the first time someone opens the app, and if they don’t start one then, they likely never will. A clear, compelling paywall in onboarding is essential to maximizing conversions.

📉 Lower prices mean higher retention

Apps with lower subscription prices retain users at significantly higher rates. High-ticket subscriptions can work if the value is obvious, but in many cases, a lower price makes the renewal decision much easier. If churn is a problem, pricing strategy should be one of the first things to review.

About Jacob Eiting:

👨‍💻 Founder & CEO of RevenueCat, the platform powering in-app subscriptions for thousands of apps.

🎯 Jacob helps app developers navigate pricing, retention, and monetization strategies to build sustainable businesses.

💡 “If your differentiation is community, if your differentiation is distribution, like you have some unique angle, you’re serving a niche, and you want to be on both platforms, React is probably a really good place to start today.”

👋 LinkedIn

Follow us on X:

• David Barnard - @drbarnard
• Jacob Eiting - @jeiting
• RevenueCat - @RevenueCat
• SubClub - @SubClubHQ

Episode Highlights:

[1:10] The power of AI: AI apps don’t convert users at a higher rate, but they do generate more revenue per user.
[12:28] Battle of the app stores: The App Store generates more money than the Play Store because there are more iOS users (not because Android users pay less).

[18:20] Hybrid vs native: A wider range of development frameworks is lowering the barrier to entry for app developers.

[24:12] Downward slide: Retention rates are declining year over year (but that’s to be expected).

[26:51] Failure to launch?: One out of every 20 apps makes more than $9,000/month one year after launching.

[34:37] Diversifying revenue: More apps are experimenting with hybrid monetization strategies, combining monthly subscriptions with consumables and lifetime subscriptions.

[39:53] Press start: 80% of free trials start the day users first open the app.

[42:13] End of the line: Cancellations of annual subscriptions happen most commonly in the first and last month.

[45:12] The price isn’t right: Lower-priced apps retain users better than higher-priced apps.

[54:20] Last touch: Active renewal rates are highest for annual subscriptions and lowest for weekly subscriptions.

This episode is shorter than usual and will be featured in RevenueCat’s State of Subscription Apps report.

On the podcast: top strategies for paywall optimization, how storytelling during onboarding impacts conversions, and why framing the user journey leading to the paywall is more critical than the paywall itself.

Top Takeaways:

🔐 Your paywall is only as good as the story leading up to it

A well-placed paywall won’t convert if users aren’t primed to see value. Guide users with a clear onboarding flow that tells a story, setting expectations and building excitement before they reach the paywall. Strong hooks, a compelling introduction, and a high-value moment just before the paywall can significantly increase conversions.

💰Use loss aversion to reinforce premium value

Encourage users to engage with premium features before showing the paywall. By having them set up key features or preferences first, you create a sense of ownership - so when they hit the paywall, rejecting the offer feels like losing access to something they’ve already invested in. This approach taps into sunk cost fallacy to boost conversions.

📱Test multi-screen paywalls for better engagement

Instead of cramming all your selling points into a single paywall, break them up into multiple screens. Showing benefits, pricing, and feature comparisons step by step can increase trial opt-ins - Mimo saw a 60% lift using this method. This also blurs the line between onboarding and monetization, giving users more time to absorb the value of upgrading.

About Sylvain Gauchet:

🌐 Director of Revenue Strategy, US at Babbel, specializing in mobile growth, app marketing, and revenue optimization for a leading language learning platform.

🛠️ Sylvain brings deep expertise in crafting data-driven growth strategies, leveraging mobile marketing, app store optimization, and curated insights to drive customer acquisition and retention. He is also the creator of GrowthGems.co, a newsletter for growth practitioners.

💡 "It's not just about optimizing the paywall—it's about the entire journey leading up to it. The story you tell through onboarding and the context you create before the paywall are what truly drive conversions. Without that, even the best-designed paywall won't perform as well as it could."

👋 Connect with Sylvain on LinkedIn!

Resources:

• Growth Gems
• App Growth Annual Conference

Follow us on X:

• David Barnard - @drbarnard
• Jacob Eiting - @jeiting
• RevenueCat - @RevenueCat
• SubClub - @SubClubHQ