Context:

This episode features the second half of the panel discussion recorded at the "Growing Out of Growth" festival, an event dedicated to exploring and promoting degrowth as a viable pathway toward a sustainable and equitable future. The panel titled "The way forward — What can we do to make degrowth a reality?"

If you did not listen to the previous part please do so.

This section of the panel captures a portion of the discussion focused on communication strategies for degrowth and a "takeaway session" summarizing key points.

Speakers:

• Ulrich Teidlt: Letzte Generation, physics educator.
• Julio Linares: Activist and economic anthropologist, Basic Income activist, author
• Carolina Rübe: Konzeptwerk Neue Ökonomie (think tank for new economy)
• Antonio Rohrßen: Former member of “Klima Liste” (a political party) and the Organizer of the Beyond Growth Germany conference
• Dr. Federica Habermann: Historian, economist, and author.

Summary:

The second part of the panel focuses on the theme of communication, specifically in the context of promoting degrowth. Key points include:

• Democratically managed commons: The panel discusses the importance of community and cooperation as alternatives to capitalist individualism. This aligns closely with the idea of commoning, which involves the collective management of resources and shared spaces.
• The Power of Storytelling: There's an emphasis on the importance of telling relatable stories to engage people with the concept of degrowth, rather than relying solely on abstract arguments.
• Reframing Narratives: The discussion touches on the need to "turn things on their head" and challenge dominant narratives, particularly those that create fear or promote unsustainable consumption.
• Community and Cooperation: The importance of community and cooperation is highlighted as a key aspect of degrowth, contrasting with the individualism often associated with capitalist ideology.
• Fun and Enjoyment: "If it isn't fun, it isn't degrowth," emphasizing the importance of enjoyment and community in the degrowth transition.
• Operating in Crises: The discussion acknowledges the need to consider how to navigate and utilize crises to advance degrowth.
• Diversity of Methods and Stakeholders: The panelists emphasized the need for a diverse range of communication methods to reach different audiences. They stress the importance of engaging with various stakeholders (privileged or neglected), acknowledging the need to tailor messages to specific groups.
• Interdependency: The interdependency of the global north and south is inevitable, and isolating oneself from global problems is impossible.

External References Mentioned:

• https://growingoutofgrowth.org/
• https://waswirtunkoennen.jetzt/ - "What can we do now", a list of degrowth actions and policies
• Timothy Morton (philosopher and author)

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Context

This episode features a panel discussion recorded at the "Growing Out of Growth" festival, an event dedicated to exploring and promoting degrowth as a viable pathway toward a sustainable and equitable future. The festival brought together researchers, activists, and practitioners to discuss the theoretical and practical aspects of degrowth, challenging the dominant growth paradigm and exploring alternative economic models lifestyles, and cultures. The panel titled "The way forward — What can we do to make degrowth a reality?" specifically focused on the practical implementation and social implications of degrowth policies.

Speakers:

• Ulrich Teidlt: Letzte Generation, physics educator.
• Julio Linares: Activist and economic anthropologist, Basic Income activist, author
• Carolina Rübe: Konzeptwerk Neue Ökonomie (think tank for new economy)
• Antonio Rohrßen: Former member of “Klima Liste” (a political party) and the Organizer of the Beyond Growth Germany conference
• Dr. Federica Habermann: Historian, economist, and author.

Summary:

The panelists begin by addressing the fundamental incompatibility of infinite economic growth with finite planetary resources. They highlight the urgent need to move away from a growth-dependent economic model, emphasizing that degrowth is not about austerity or deprivation but about creating a more sustainable and equitable society.

The discussion then delves into specific degrowth policies and strategies. Key themes include:

• Reduction of resource consumption: The need to reduce our ecological footprint by consuming less and producing more sustainably.
• Redistribution of wealth: Addressing inequality by redistributing wealth and resources more equitably.
• Transformation of work: The panel explores the potential for shorter working hours and alternative forms of work that prioritize well-being and social value over profit.
• Rethinking consumption patterns: The speakers discuss the need to shift away from consumerism and towards more sustainable and fulfilling lifestyles.
• The urgency of climate action: The need for radical changes in our economic and social systems to address the climate crisis.

The speakers also touch upon the challenges of implementing degrowth, including the need to overcome resistance from vested interests and to build broad public support for change.

Organizers: https://growingoutofgrowth.org/

External sources / Book Recommendations:

• DW enteignen - an initiative to socialize and democratize the Berlin housing market

By Dr. Federica Habermann

• Ausgetauscht - Warum gutes Leben für alle tauschlogikfrei sein muss
• Ecommony - UmCARE zum Miteinander

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In the second episode of The Postmaterialist Podcast, host Ilya Sogolov sits down with writer and philosopher Stefan Heidenreich for a thought-provoking discussion about the potential for a society without money.

They sit inside a pod in a library, which alongside a defective microphone cable makes the conversation sound a bit like it was on the phone. However, with a bit of post-production actions, this effect is not as bad now.

Building on the ideas presented in Episode 1 with Jonathan Gan-Mor of The Venus Project, this episode explores the challenges and possibilities of a post-monetary world. Heidenreich, with his background in philosophy, media theory, and economics, offers a unique perspective on how our current economic system shapes behavior and creates artificial scarcity. Heidenreich offers a conceptual way forward and in fact says that a replacement of money by artificial intelligence is unavoidable at some point in the future.

One of the central themes of the conversation revolves around the three functions of money, as outlined by Aristotle: measuring value, facilitating transactions, and storing value. Heidenreich argues as he did in the book "Geld. Für eine non-monetäre Ökonomie -Money-For a non-monetary Economy" that it is the third function - the hoarding of money - that lies at the root of many of our current societal ills.

Both Sogolov and Heidenreich agree that a significant portion of the scarcity we experience today is artificial. They discuss how a reliance on money necessitates scarcity to maintain today's economics.

The conversation then turns towards the role of technology, specifically artificial intelligence (AI), in potentially facilitating a transition to a post-money society. Heidenreich envisions a future where advanced data analysis and AI could create an efficient system for distributing resources and managing an economy. However, he also acknowledges the potential pitfalls of relying too heavily on technology.

Heidenreich proposes the intriguing concept of a transaction system where individual accounts are regularly reset to zero once a balance between contributions and consumption is achieved. This, he suggests, could help prevent over-accumulation while still allowing individuals to "take credit" and access resources beyond their immediate means for a limited time.

Heidenreich challenges listeners to consider alternative frameworks for understanding and organizing society – frameworks that prioritize human well-being and ecological sustainability over endless economic growth. He suggests that by shifting our perspective and embracing new ways of thinking, we can begin to envision and create a future where money no longer dictates the terms of our existence.

This episode offers a dense and multifaceted exploration of a complex topic. It encourages listeners to question their assumptions about the world and to engage in critical thinking about the potential for a post-money future.

This episode may leave the listeners (as it left the Postmaterialist host) with a need to read and learn more about, philosophy. economy, and above all human behavior. The latter topic is a growing gap in the knowledge needed for system change. So If you happen to know experts in human behavior, feel free to contact the Postmaterialist podcast.

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